AT Quote Proposal
From: dottie zold
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 4:06 pm
Subject: AT Quote Proposal
Peter Staudenmaier:
[From
"RS about Racial Evolution"]
No, it doesn't. Evolution is about plants,
animals, and so forth. Cultures are fundamentally different things.
AT Quote of the Year. I propose this as quote
of the year and then,
Peter Staudenmaier:
Yes. It largely operates by natural selection,
a mostly random process that is not progressive and has no goal.
None of this has anything to do with cultures.
the one above for AT Quote of the Month.
Made my day,
Dottie
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From: Peter Staudenmaier
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 6:33 pm
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] AT Quote Proposal
Hi Dottie,
do you think that "culture" is a biological phenomenon,
that it is hereditary, that it is passed on via the genes? Could
you explain why you think that? Thanks,
Peter
...................................................................................................................................
From: dottie zold
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 8:10 pm
Subject: Re: AT Quote Proposal
Peter:
do you think that "culture" is
a biological phenomenon, that it is hereditary, that it is passed
on via the genes? Could you explain why you think that? Thanks,
And I said that where, Peter? If you are going
to state what I think you should at least get it straight. Unfortunately
this is the same thing you do with all whom debate with you.
You give them a reputation to live down to. Pretty interesting.
So, where in my statement do you see, which of course I made
none other than to show the ridiculousness of your quote, that
I am saying I think 'culture is a biological phenomenon? What
silliness.
What you can't see past in all your readings
of Dr. Steiner and his students is that 'evolution' does not
just involve plants, animals and so forth. The ridiculousness
of stating 'cultures' do not evolve is absoutely stunning for
me to see it in actual writing. Maybe I give you too much credit
for intellectual prowess.
So, how is it you come to the idea that evolution
does not include human beings? Do you not see the ignorance in
this kind of statement? Do you think men are just a lump of clay
with no point of moving forward in mind and spirit? Oh, I forgot,
you don't go to the spiritual aspect. Therefore we are stuck
in the dead letter word of what Peter thinks. And truly it is
what I am witnessing on line: people trying to rationalize with
you when there really is nothing to rationalize. You only want
one point to be shown and so we keep getting dragged down to
your none understanding points as you keep thinking you are finding
something. You are finding nothing Peter but dead letter words
and you can not see it.
And another ignorant observation, but I do
not think it can be called an observation, is 'evolution operates
by a mostly random process that is not progressive and has no
goal.' What the hell are you possibly thinking of Peter? Seriously.
Are you really that closed off to thinking past what you can
physically see with your own eyes that you do not allow yourself
to contemplate the wonder of this world and what has happened
and where we are and where we might be going?
Maybe you have not. Maybe it is your mindset
and there is naught that will change with this point of yours
in your mind. Too bad for you. Truly. And my thought and wonder
is, how did this come about in your life? How is it that you
have brought yourself to a point where you see no correlation
between what has been and what is and what will be? Was it some
teacher in college or maybe highschool? I mean what the hell
happened for you to come to this particular point of view? Who
was the instigator in this mess of yours? And it is a mess. I
say that as a friend. I would not naturally say this if I didn't
care I would just let it be and that is that. But you sir have
brought yourself before me and so you get to hear my words. Ignore
them you can, but say them not is not a possibility for me.
Much love to you Peter,
Dottie
p.s. And I am sure there are many quotes of
mine that could easily be put up on this list as Quote of the
Month as well. Do not fret.
And so it goes on and on and on and on and
on and on and on and on and
...................................................................................................................................
From: Peter Staudenmaier
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 9:41 am
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: AT Quote Proposal
Hi Dottie, you wrote:
If you are going to state what I think you should at least
get it straight.
I didn't state what you think. I asked you what you think. Surely
you can tell the difference.
So, where in my statement do you see, which of course I made
none other than to show the ridiculousness of your quote, that
I am saying I think 'culture is a biological phenomenon?
My quote could only seem ridiculous to someone who thinks that
culture is a biological phenomenon. If you don't think that culture
is a biological phenomenon, then why did you disagree with my
observation that cultural evolution and biological evolution
are fundamentally different things, and that natural selection
has nothing to do with culture?
The ridiculousness of stating 'cultures' do not evolve is
absoutely stunning for me to see it in actual writing.
I didn't state that cultures do not evolve. I stated that biological
evolution, structured as it is around natural selection, is a
fundamentally different kind of evolution. I also stated that
there is little sense in designating one culture as more advanced
than another
So, how is it you come to the idea that evolution does not
include human beings?
I didn't come to that idea. Human beings evolved just as trees
did.
Do you think men are just a lump of clay with no point of
moving forward in mind and spirit?
No. But this has nothing whatsoever to do with the idea of racial
evolution. Lots of people who believe in moving forward in mind
and spirit reject the notion of progressive racial evolution.
And another ignorant observation, but I do not think it can
be called an observation, is 'evolution operates by a mostly
random process that is not progressive and has no goal.' What
the hell are you possibly thinking of Peter?
I am thinking of natural evolution. I get the sense that you
don't know much about contemporary evolutionary biology. The
notion that evolution is directed toward a goal of ever greater
perfection is mistaken.
Peter
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