Will You Ever get a President You Like

From: Kim Munch Michelsen
Date: Sun Dec 21, 2003 11:49 am
Subject: Will you ever get a president you like

Hello everybody

You know, everybody who want's to be president, want's power!

And the president has power!

And no spiritual seeker who is right in his/her head want to go for precidency!

SO, HOW IS YOUR IDEA OF AN IDEAL PRESIDENT

I have a few keywords (I havent thought it throuh fully, but here is a few)

I don't want any idealist! They can be dangerous as hell.

If he/she is a little lazy it vould be OK, they are to lazy to be fanatical.

He should not be to intelligent, they might get some stupid ideas without any relation to the real world.

My primary wish is that he has common sence (which is the same as natural wisdom).

That he is good to choose advisors.

And he has guts to do what is necessary, if need be.

What is your dream president???

Kim

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From: Tarjei Straume
Date: Sun Dec 21, 2003 12:05 pm
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

At 20:49 21.12.2003, Kim wrote:

What is your dream president???

Richard Milhous Nixon. And with your question in mind, about a dream president, while celebrating the season, just a couple of days before Christmas, let's go to the "Common Dream News Center" and read about president Nixon's Christmas bombings in 1972:

http://www.commondreams.org/views02/1224-04.htm

That's my dream president: One who knows how to dish out Christmas gifts worthy only of an imperial world leader.

Tarjei
http://uncletaz.com/

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From: Kim Munch Michelsen
Date: Sun Dec 21, 2003 12:33 pm
Subject: RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

Well, I think he had a problem with both common sense (lying and Watergate was absolutely againt common sense) and he had a problem with his chosen advisors, especially his 'co-president' Kissinger. Without the screwdness of Kissinger, I think that things would have looked quite different.

Kim

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From: Tarjei Straume
Date: Sun Dec 21, 2003 3:31 pm
Subject: RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

At 21:33 21.12.2003, Kim wrote:

Well, I think he had a problem with both common sense (lying and Watergate was absolutely againt common sense) and he had a problem with his chosen advisors, especially his 'co-president' Kissinger. Without the screwdness of Kissinger, I think that things would have looked quite different.

BBC has made an excellent documentary series about Watergate. I got a good peak twice, first on BBC World, and now on BBC Prime (both channels available outside the UK).

Richard Nixon is a fascinating character, and Watergate is an intriguing drama. I mentioned the 1972 Christmas bombing because it's the most immoral thing Nixon ever did; Watergate is peanuts in comparison, and basically a Comedy of Errors. But there is a Hitler link in the middle of all this, and this link goes through the most eccentric of them all: George Gordon Liddy. Finance Counsel for the Committee for the Re-Election of the President (CREEP). Liddy, who became infatuated with Hitler as a child when his German nanny listened to der Führer's speeches on the radio, not only masterminded the Watergate break-in and hired call girls in Miami to seduce Democrats and extract information from them. No, in the middle of the 1972 campaign, Liddy assembled the entire White House staff one evening to have them watch the Nazi propaganda film "Triumph of the Will."

http://www.aaamoviesearch.com/Movie/dvd/B00004WLXZ

So there they were, Haldeman and Erlichman and Dean and Nixon and Liddy and the whole crowd, watching Adolf Hitler's blockbuster movie "Triumph of the Will" in the White House.

Fascinating.

Tarjei
http://uncletaz.com/

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From: Gisele
Date: Sun Dec 21, 2003 2:32 pm
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

~~~~Hey, what about anthroanarchy? Why would we dream of such obsolete thought-forms such as 'presidents'?

Gix

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From: Tarjei Straume
Date: Sun Dec 21, 2003 2:44 pm
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

At 23:32 21.12.2003, Gisele wrote:

~~~~Hey, what about anthroanarchy? Why would we dream of such obsolete thought-forms such as 'presidents'?

Hmmm..... Wasn't RS the president of AS?

The point is that it's possible to be president without taking political office. Perhaps we should elect a president for Anthroposophy Tomorrow. Plus a vice president, a chief of staff and all that jazz. I once drove for a cab company in L.A. that had a president and a vice president and so on. It was an association. The Threefold Social Order consists of associations with plenty of presidents of all kinds.

Anthroanarchy? A guru? A junta? A prophet? No, just a messenger. We draw straws each month about who it's going to be the next four weeks. The chosen one is the gopher.

That's it. The anthroanarchy has a gopher, one who makes the coffee, receives heads of states, entertains them, gives them messages, and sends them on their way.

Tarjei

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From: Joel Wendt
Date: Mon Dec 22, 2003 8:57 am
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

On Sun, 2003-12-21 at 12:49, Kim Munch Michelsen wrote:

What is your dream president???

Dear Kim,

What is my dream president? Me. Think I'm crazy? Try this essay on my former campaign website: "Re-imagining the Conduct of the Presidency - a Presidential Campaign as an Act of Statecraft, and the Presidency as the Art and Craft of Statesmanship - "; at: http://ipwebdev.com/campaign/cg12.html

warm and silly regards,
joel

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From: dottie zold
Date: Mon Dec 22, 2003 6:35 pm
Subject: Re: Will you ever get a president you like

Kim wrote:
And no spiritual seeker who is right in his/her head want to go for presidency!

Hi Kim,

I might think you are right but this weekend I had to look at my non violence way of being. I try not to kill anything not even cockroaches, daddy long leggers, or any other creepy thing I may find anywhere within my vicinity.

Up until this weekend I would say ' I wouldn't kill in my defense. I would allow myself to be killed before I would kill. Yet a thought is coming up about the possibility of evil within my understanding. I am a warrior yet I am at the point, or at least so I thought that I would lay down my sword before being killed. That there is at some point within the enlightment that we surrender. Yet, when looking at battles that are forced upon oneself I do not know that my way of understanding is realistic for my self. Hence the idea of a spiritual seeker seeking the Presidency seems to be along side that stream. One would take up the battle to serve this Presidency or one could be like the hermits and do the work from the side. Which way is correct? I don't know.

As far as Presidents I want one with the convictions of Robert Byrd of Virginia or Hilary Clinton who she is now. I think President Clinton would be a better president if he had it all to do again. I also like Gore and Jeffords of Rhode Island. I like a man/woman who is not afraid to tell the truth and stand up for what he believes in and allow the chips to fall where they may. I hope to see Hillary in that high office.

Love,
d

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From: Kim Munch Michelsen
Date: Tue Dec 23, 2003 11:32 am
Subject: RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

As I said to Dottie, we have the leaders we derserve;-)

Kim

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From: Tarjei Straume
Date: Tue Dec 23, 2003 11:48 am
Subject: RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

At 20:32 23.12.2003, Kim wrote:

As I said to Dottie, we have the leaders we derserve;-)

You're opening a whole new can of worms with that statement. We have leaders? You have leaders perhaps, they have leaders, someone out there has leaders, but not me. I don't have any leaders. I wish the media would waste less time on those so-called leaders. I wish people would learn to ignore them. Of course, they make decisions that effect us, but so do store managers when they decide what to put on their shelves. That doesn't make them our leaders. Please call them anything else, but not our leaders.

Hail to nobody!

(well, except our Baby God in the crib of course, but that's different.)

Tarjei
http://uncletaz.com/

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From: Kim Munch Michelsen
Date: Tue Dec 23, 2003 11:25 am
Subject: RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Will you ever get a president you like

H i Dottie

You don't know if you can kill, until you are in such a situation.

One thing is if it is yourself who is at risk, but what if it is your sister, your child, your neighbor, your neighbors child, a child or a techer in your school, a woman in a bank, a child in South Africa,......

You should love your next as yourself.

What I ment with the quetion was to get people down to earth.

We have the leaders we deserve, to get better leaders, we have to be better ourselves, all of us.

If we got a saint as leader, the inertia of our system would stop him.

Happy Christmas,
Kim

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From: golden3000997
Date: Tue Dec 23, 2003 5:14 pm
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

Hi Kim,

I have been mulling your question over for days now and this morning, while getting ready for work, I started to have an idea of this person. No one that we know of now. I think it has real potential for a novel!!

He is someone who has grown up in an Illuminati family and raised to be a top leader, possibly a president. But he has another vision of himself while still quite young (teens, maybe) and realizes that he was born to bring down this establishment from within. He is very strong in himself and very intelligent and he knows that he can't fight until the time is right. He always feels a bit lonely and "estranged" but his family is loving and supportive and he accepts that they are who they are. He goes along with everything, more or less, but not in a wishy-washy way, more like a spy, storing up experiences and information. Along the way he meets only a handful of people that he can trust with his inner secret, or at least pieces of it. He doesn't want to reveal everything to anyone because he knows it could be dangerous when his time comes.

He studies political science and economics, goes to the schools he is groomed for, takes the jobs he is groomed for, but all the time he studies and learns the truth about both worlds. Maybe he is an initiate of sorts. (This is all going to sound way too simplistic - I told you it would need to be thought out in depth.)

At the opening of the novel, he is sitting in the penthouse in New York on the eve of the Presidential Election. There is a kind of party going on, his family, friends and campaign supporters are all there. They are happy, but no one is excited, because they already know the result. They know that everything has been arranged. This is contrasted with the campaign headquarters of the other candidate. He has been duped into thinking that he is really running for President and might win. So everyone there is tense and excited.

Our hero is not excited, but he's not depressed, angry or anxious, either. He can take it all in stride. He knows that everyone at the party is very happy with him. They fully expect that he knows what their agendas are and that he has the brains, strength and charisma to carry them forward. The debates that he has had with his uncles and mentors over the years have been fruitful and shown a good capacity for friendly disagreement, but no one could have any suspicion that he thought anything amiss about the "family" or its value system. He has a wife but no children. She is intelligent and sometimes more openly rebellious that he has been. But even with her, he hasn't shared his "real self", at least not fully. She sometimes suspects there is a depth to him that she can't see, but she hopes that he will share this with her in time.

- Well, this could go on a long time and maybe it will at some point. But the essential idea that this man carries is real human freedom. There are ideas in him that could be linked to the "Free American" movement, some that could be linked to conservative streams, some to radical streams. That is why he has stayed relatively quiet and middle of the road. He knows that revealing what is in his heart too soon would get him co-opted by and labeled as a member of any number of groups. His agendas and ideals are far beyond that. In the way that his Illuminati "family" is cosmic in it's power perspectives and their devotion to economics and eugenics, so he is cosmic in his human perspective and he is devoted to the inherent potential within the individual to be free in his or herself and the potential to develop the ability to act out of true brotherhood in the economic reality of the world. (ie - Threefold Social Order - phase I - the Paradigm Shift).

I started to go on, then stopped. Anything I say more specific would be debated and put into slots right now, so I can't talk more about his agenda. But it has to be a wielding of power only for the sake of giving it back to the individual human being. It is complex and any attempt at simplification would be a mistake. He would have to be someone that others would want to "follow" but they would somehow find out that they couldn't. That every road would lead back to themselves, like Alice in the Looking Glass garden.

Just to let you know that it was a good question - very thought -provoking!

Love and Light,
Christine

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From: Kim Munch Michelsen
Date: Wed Dec 24, 2003 5:00 am
Subject: RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

I know that I opened a can of worms;-)

As long as you have the right to vote it is your leaders, if you use your right or not.

One of the reason for my anarchistic views is that if we have the leaders we deserve, then they should have as little power as possible. We cannot ignore them, we have to work to change the ideas in ourselves and in the public, to remove the power. It is the fight against Ahriman.

ditto: Hail to nobody!-)

Kim

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From: golden3000997
Date: Wed Dec 24, 2003 5:19 am
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

Wavy Gravy for President!!

(You know, he's still around and doing lots of good and groovy things!)

: ) Christine

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From: Richard Distasi
Date: Wed Dec 24, 2003 5:35 am
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

Kim wrote:

ditto: Hail to nobody!-)

STOP RIGHT THERE MISTER !!!! :-) :-) :-)

I say:

Hail to the birds, the trees, the clouds, the sun, the rain, the daylight, the night, the seasons, the sound of children laughing (my favorite), the good, the true, the beautiful, the joys of life, the sorrows of life and the Spirit that lives in us all.

To everyone:

Have a wonderful Christmas,

rick distasi

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From: Kim Munch Michelsen
Date: Wed Dec 24, 2003 7:24 am
Subject: RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

Thats all right, but i prefer: LOVE to everybody.

Kim

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From: Tarjei Straume
Date: Wed Dec 24, 2003 6:32 am
Subject: RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

At 14:00 24.12.2003, Kim wrote:

I know that I opened a can of worms;-)

As long as you have the right to vote it is your leaders, if you use your right or not.

You have the right to tell the store manager which products you would like to find in his shelves too. Some comply with your wishes, others don't. Some people express their desires to store managers, others dont. But it doesn't make them our leaders any way you twist it. A store manager may become your employer and supervisor on the job if you start working there, but that still doesn't make him or her your leader, except in the limited sense if a customer says, "Take me to your Leader."

If someone stopped you on the street and, "Take me to your Leader," what would you do?

Tarjei
http://uncletaz.com/

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From: Kim Munch Michelsen
Date: Wed Dec 24, 2003 7:48 am
Subject: RE: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Will you ever get a president you like

If they came from Cassiopeja, I would send them to UN, otherwise I would not know what they talked about.

If you earn money you have to pay taxes, if you have a car, you have to follow the rules for driving. Whatever you do someone has put rules op you have to follow, and if you don't, you have to follow another set of rules, made for that occasion, giving you no way to escape. They are not your leader, but they are the leader of the state, which is an influentional part of the country you are living in. I see the state as a kind of cancer, which is changing the equilibrium of the country dangerously. And as scandinavians, we know better than most, while we live in the most regulated countries in the world. (No state has build a tax system as sophisticated as the Danish|-(

Kim

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